is co-founder, along with his wife Pam, of the Sustainable Traditions project. He is curator/editor/illustrator/webmaster of the ST blogazine and envisions this virtual space as a voice for church renewal and Holy Spirit inspired resilience. Jason lives with his wife and six kids by the Blue Ridge Mountains in Bedford, Virginia plotting a course toward intentional Christian community. Find him on Twitter as @wiselywoven and @sustainabletrad
  • http://twitter.com/calebjturner Caleb Turner

    You quote on of Berry’s weaker elements, in my opinion. His willingness to do away with the radical Otherness of GOD is problematic. The eschatological problem is not one of dualism vs. monism, but rather of directionality. As you mention at the end, we are inheriting a Kingdom Coming. We are not going “there” to it, but rather He/It is coming to dwell with us here. We need not revert to monism to acknowledge this. (Of course, I should mention that some dualisms he mentions are indeed sin. But Scripture is our guide here, as it reinforces some dualisms and eradicates others. Our theology shouldn’t end up looking like a bottle of Dr. Bronner’s :)

    • http://www.wiselywoven.com J Fowler

      Hi Caleb. Thanks for the comment. I suppose you could read Mr. Berry as veering away from a Scriptural view of GOD and the world but I don’t interpret him the way that you are. I read him as saying GOD is our sustainer and his breath upholds us all. I don’t see him advocating a kind of New Age monism of Creation but rather calling Christians to find their place again in the community of Creation. The author Norman Wirzba seems to elaborate on Mr. Berry’s ‘agrarian theology’ in his books. I suggest checking him out. Also – I think the problem of dualism is directly related to our eschatology – I see it as a lense that is distorting all aspects of our theology. But it is a subtle undercurrent that mostly goes unperceived. I’d love to hash out some of these arguments in person. I’ll see you next week. -shalom bro!

  • Lori

    I’m right there with you on this subject. Not only in the church, but in
    modern western culture as a whole, we have become increasingly
    disconnected from our bodies and the earth. The price we pay for it is
    massive. As followers of Jesus, our primary objective is to bring heaven
    to earth. Often I encounter those who place all hope in the afterlife,
    and have little to no hope in the resurrection power of Jesus to work in
    the here and now. They bear their time on this earth as a burden, a
    necessary trial to pass through so that they can get to the glory on the
    other side. We know there is redemption here and now!

    I’m am glad to have found this space; I enjoy reading here!

    • http://www.wiselywoven.com J Fowler

      Lori: Thank you for the encouragement! I think the LORD is taking many of us on a journey towards living in His kingdom now – here. I feel sad for many of us who refuse to believe that GOD can break in here and now. Thanks for the comment and thanks for being on the journey with us!

  • http://www.facebook.com/coffee.dahlstrom Richard Dahlstrom

    I love what you’ve been writing lately Jason! Thanks for putting voice to what I’m preaching in my church here in Seattle. While I agree with what you’re saying, I find myself troubled by the seeming “both/and” of the New Testament regarding eschatology. Not only is the kingdom coming here, but the earth will be burned up with fire, according to Peter. It’s Peter’s version, I believe, that leads to ‘drill baby drill’ and I wish it weren’t there, but it is. What do you make of it?

    Also, I love your phrase, about how we pray either “send your son back quickly” or “bring your kingdom on earth” etc. The trouble is that the NT prays both, as evidenced in the cry “Maranatha”.

    How do you deal with these tensions? I’m a huge fan of NT Wright, but have yet to read anything, anywhere, that wrestles with this adequately. Thanks for the dialogue!!

    • http://www.wiselywoven.com J Fowler

      Richard: thank you for your great feedback. I see the two prayers ‘Father, your will be done on earth as it is in heaven’ and ‘Come Lord Jesus’ – as a single impulse. When we say ‘come’ we are asking for the fulfillment of GOD’s plan of redemption which Jesus will usher in. When we pray ‘maranatha’ with the attitude of a prisoner longing to escape prison – I wonder if we’ve missed something huge. Also, I believe the whole council of Scripture points clearly to a time of reckoning at the end of this age. It is spoken of in both the Old and New Testament – it will be a day of fire and judging of evil and for those who refuse GOD’s mercy and grace – they will be in dread. The part that we have forgotten as the Church – and left out for generations – is that the story does not end with judgement and the material realm being destroyed and us going to Heaven – the story ends in GOD’s New Creation and the resurrection of the material realm as it is merged with the heavenly realm under Jesus. Heaven is coming to Earth and Jesus will inaugurate ‘The Age to Come’ when He will accomplish ‘The Renewal/Reconciliation of All Things’. Sometimes what appears to be opposing truths in the Bible are really two tension points – like tent pegs that are upholding a larger revelation under which we can take shelter.

  • Neil

    I love Wendell Berry. I’ve always wanted to read his stuff and decided I wanted to quote him in a book I was co-writing. I felt it wouldn’t be right to do so w/o buying it so I did. Incidentally I saw someone here in the UK reading one of his books. I was staring trying to work which one it was when he covered it up obviously thinking I was being nosy (which I was). Richard, I heard NT Wright at Greenbelt speaking on the gospels and Christian hope. You might find the talk helpful. One thing he said was that we underemphasis the Jesus between his birth and resurrection and one thing I found very helpful is that we are building for the kingdom, not the kingdom, God does that. I would add, hopefully despite my sin. In my book we looked at this issue of the obsession with the end times. I dug out some old books by Michael Green and John Stott, their view was this unhelpful because it stopped us thinking about building the kingdom now, and there we are back to NT Wright.

    Like the site by the way.

    http://www.theoillamp.co.uk

    • http://www.wiselywoven.com J Fowler

      Hi Neil, Thanks for the thoughtful comment. You’re book and website look very interesting. I’m glad you mentioned NT Wright – while I haven’t read much of his work I have heard that my views are similar to his. I have greatly appreciated everything I have heard from him (videos online ,etc – and I have his book ‘Evil and the Justice of GOD’). In response to your comment about how we focus too much on ‘the End Times’ which causes us to become disembodied Christians – I would counter that a bit by saying: I don’t think it’s that we think too much about the end of the story – I think we are thinking wrongly. Maybe we need to even focus more on the ‘end of the age’ – to really study it instead of just accepting that it ends with earth burning and we go whisking off to heaven. The Bible clearly portrays a time of cataclysm and eventually judgment as we transition into the Age to Come and the Restoration of All Things at Jesus’ return. For many Christians – we stop there – with destruction of the material realm and us going to be with GOD – but the Bible says GOD is bringing heaven to earth and will resurrect His created order – in a New Creation – new heavens and a new earth. We live badly because we have bad theology – or rather we live incompletely because we have an incomplete theological imagination. How we think about the future determines how we live in the present. My argument is for a deeper look at the Age to Come because we all are living backwards from our view of what is to come.

  • jobeob987

    Hello: A few weeks ago Wendell Barry was on the Diane Rehm Show on Radio IQ 89.5. He sounds as genuine and real as his writings portray him. Here is another quote from him that rocked my world with it accuracy

    “The organized church makes peace with a destructive
    economy and divorces itself from economic issues because it is
    economically compelled to do so. Like any other public institution so
    organized, the organized church is dependent on “the economy”; it cannot
    survive apart from those economic practices that its truth forbids and
    that its vocation is to correct.

    If it comes to a choice between the extermination of the fowls of the
    air and the lilies of the field and the extermination of the building
    fund, the organized church will elect—indeed, has already elected—to
    save the building fund. The irony is compounded and made harder to bear
    by the fact that the building fund can be preserved by crude
    applications of money, but the fowls of the air and the lilies of the
    field can be preserved only by true religion, by the practice of a
    proper love and respect for them as the creatures of God. No wonder so
    many sermons are devoted exclusively to “spiritual” subjects. If one is
    living by the tithes of history’s most destructive economy, then the
    disembodiment of the soul becomes the chief of worldly conveniences.”

    And you said “It’s a like a burden in my chest. My heart races when I think of it. It’s a divine disturbance that many of us are hearing.”

    This is how I feel most of the time. Since finding the Barry quote more than a year ago and even before, I started to notice that we as Christians are (as Brian McLaren put it) “between something broken and something new”. I also have noticed that there are many that feel the same way. Even Billy Graham feels that God is working in a different way now. I believe that all Christians are being invited to restore the world to the state of “Good” that it was when it was created. A perceptible move of God is at hand and the more I look around the more I realize that the ideas in my own head have not been share enough for so many to have come to the same conclusions. This is encouraging because if God is behind this then it will be successful and at the same time it is challenging because if it is the work of God then we have got to participate.

    James

    • http://www.wiselywoven.com J Fowler

      Thanks for the comment James! Somehow I missed it when you originally commented. I indeed agree with you that GOD is on the move – and I believe it will be more radical than any revival or reformation that has come before. Let’s pray and live towards this end. -shalom bro!